Centerfield

It's not just you. I've heard many otherwise apparently sane and sensible people express their devout belief that Chimpy Bushitler and Cheney McHalliburton will certainly cancel the 2008 elections and install themselves as rulers-for-life, using the military. And they were serious.

Or at least they said they were. I have offered 10-1 odds that it's not gonna happen, but it seems that the wingnuttery oft fails to stave off doubt when cash upfront is required.

In the Clinton era it was the UN-assisted plot that was gonna use the black helicopters to herd all the True God-Fearing Gun-Loving Loving Patriots into the concentration camps. Just to prove a good paranoid conspiracy theory never dies, it just morphs and mutates, the current spin is that Halliburton and the US military are going to herd all the True Socialist-Dissenter Anti-War Patriots into concentration camps....

And so it goes.

Maybe it's just wishful thinking. Someone who is so enjoying hating a particular administration has the fact of its departure staring them in the face. The only way to hang on to the object of their hate is if there is a coup to keep it in power.

Presto! Prediction of just such a coup. Besides, such a dastardly deed would provide one more thing to hate.

Alas, the hated administrations always ride off into the sunset as scheduled. Leaving nothing to do but hope a new object of hate will appear eventually. Meanwhile: berift haters -- no matter how sane and sensible they are in other areas. Maybe having someone to hate allows them to keep their balance in the rest of their lives.

Scary that people who otherwise seem intelligent can believe the most outlandish and far-fetched theories. Still, it makes you wonder: What would it take to have a coup in the U.S.? What kind of situation would make this country surrender what makes it unique?

Do you mean arresting the President and other administration officals (if necessary) and letting the Speaker take over? Or do you mean a military coup?

That is a good question. In Musharraf's case he claims his President tried to place him in confinement, so he ousted the President with the support of the military.

Imagine MacArthur doing that, or Truman.

Now declaring martial law would be a more realistic idea. We can think of a number of things that could produce that. An attack on the US shortly before the elections might give an administration reason to delay voting. Many worried that might happen in 2004. I wonder if those who think a coup is coming also oppose guns or more State control of national guard forces.

I'm not sure a US coup of any sort is practical, because, well, you need help to do a coup, and I don't see it forthcoming here.

You might be able to get a few generals to go along, but only a minority of officers or men in any unit will go along. We have a long tradition of a civilian-controlled democratic military, carefully passed along to each new generation. You could play some tricks, but once it became clear that was what they were, people would stop cooperating.

It seems pretty likely me that the thought passed through MacArthur's head, but those hard facts have to've been obvious to him as well. His army didn't care more about him than their rights. Or maybe his sense of duty kept him from trying; we'll never know.

To me, the interesting question is, what's the latest moment in history a US coup could've gone down? Though, before WWII the lack of a big standing army makes things tougher as well. It'd only be maybe practical around wartime. Andy Jackson, at the end of the War of 1812, maybe, following his triumph at New Orleans? Or using the forces he raised and sent to South Carolina as President?

Just one more thing that the nation owes George Washington. He could have been the military man who took power -- but he declined. In the face of lots of pleas to do so, too. As a result, nobody since has been in a position to do so. Jackson couldn't have; Washington's example was still too close. And by the time that aspect of Washington was fading from memory, the culture was set.

It isn't just its place in the values of the general population. The general population might be persuaded that their security demanded it. But the US military culture wouldn't put up with it. And not only do you need help, as Jon notes, to pull off and maintain a coup, you need to not have the bulk of the military actively fighting you. And you couldn't get that.

Great answers to my question, all. I agree, the modern military would simply be unable to support that kind of action. Far more likely is a major attack that forces the government to suspend certain liberties or delay an election, and even then I doubt it could go for long.