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November 17, 2003

What If It Went Down Like This?

Maybe that Tom Clancy novel I’m reading is a bad influence. But I had a discussion with a co-worker related to Andrew Sullivan’s "fisking" of Wesley Clark, and we came to an agreement on what might well have REALLY gone down in the immediate aftermath of 9/11. So I’m wondering what anyone else thinks about this...

Our feeling is that, very soon after 9/11, the Bush admin quickly decided on their response. An invasion of Afghanistan was a foregone conclusion, with the goal of the ouster of the Taliban and the destruction of as much of Al Quaeda as possible. Here's what I said to him after reading the Sullivan article which strives to make Clark look as bad a spossible



"Yeah, it seems apparent that, having been weaned on the US Army, Clark is a master of talking out of both sides of his mouth, and has been unprepared for just how much more difficult it is to get away with this when everyone is watching all the time."


"That said, 2 points:"


"Clark still makes a good case in a variety of similar essays that the benefits of a multilateral approach are worth the sacrifice of some autonomy."


"The author, Andrew Sullivan, is a well-known pro-war zealot and reflexive defender of the Bush administration. That's probably why he quickly jumps on Clark for being "Ross Perot crazy" for suggesting that the Pentagon/admin had discussed a plan to go on a rampage of toppling ME regimes. IMO, there's little doubt that the topic was broached, how seriously no one knows. But here's the part of Sullivan's description of Clark that I don't think is crazy at all:"


Shortly after the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001, Clark said, he visited the Pentagon, where an old colleague, a three-star general, confided to him that the civilian authorities running the Pentagon--Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and his team--planned to use the September 11th attacks as a pretext for going to war against Iraq. "They made the decision to attack Iraq sometime soon after 9/11," Clark said. "So, rather than searching for a solution to a problem, they had the solution, and their difficulty was to make it appear as though it were in response to a problem."


"Now I'd quarrel with the use of the word "pretext" since it suggests invalid reasoning. But I have almost no doubt that this decision was made pretty promptly after 9/11 and that turning away from it was never a serious possibility. The whole UN thing was mostly done as an obligatory going through the motions. War in Iraq could only have been averted if Hussein stepped down, which no one viewed as a real possibility.



In shorthand, what I think really happened is that in the immediate aftermath of 9/11 Bush met with a small circle of advisors, and the gist of the conclusions arrived at were as follows: OK, Afghanistan is a foregone conclusion. The Taliban are done, dead men walking. But that's not enough. We need to make a serious example of someone. Saddam Hussein is the very obvious (and indeed only sensible)choice.

Anyone who is defending the adminstration is loath to admit anything close to this for obvious PR reasons, but that's how I think it went down.


And to be frank, if I were the President, I might well have done the same thing. So as I've thought about it more and more, it has troubled me less and less. But for Sullivan to call Clark crazy for suggesting it just reveals his reflexive biases as a Bush apologist on the war. I don't think less of Clark at ALL for saying it, instead I think less of Sullivan.



Do you disagree with the idea that the decision to invade Iraq got very firm very fast after 9/11, and that nothing less than Hussein stepping down could have averted it?

My co-worker was in absolute agreement. Now of course, I have no inside knowledge, but the scenario I describe seems pretty plausible, and, like I said, I have to admit I may well have chosen such a path. Thoughts, anyone?

Posted by Brian Keegan at November 17, 2003 08:45 PM
Comments

Sullivan's hit piece on Clark was over-the-top. I was planning on "fisking" it myself, but I've been busy with other projects. I think Sullivan has decided he needs to carry water for the hard-right on this to make up for his liberal stance on gay rights and his concern about the deficit.

It's pretty clear the Bush admininstration locked into a decision to invade Iraq pretty early, and the trip to the UN was just window dressing.

It's certainly not morally wrong to have liberated the Iraqis from Saddam. But as to whether it was wise in the realpolitik sense, that is seeming increasingly less defensible.

Posted by: rickheller at November 17, 2003 10:08 PM

That has been my hunch as well. If it were decided as events unfolded, there should have been a clear "we have to do it" argument, and that I never heard to my satisfaction. I also do not feel that the Iraq invasion was a "wrong" thing, but I wish that we (the American people "we") had been given a more forthright explanation of the case for war, a "we should because" kind of explanation.. There was all this debate about whether it was a necessary thing, with the administration saying it was essentially, meaning that a responible leader was required to do it in defense of the nation; in fact, it was a war we "chose" and for good reasons.

The difference between "had to" and "chose to" is a very big one. When I concluded that it was a choice and that I did not have to keeping searching for some "had to" explanation that made sense, it led down a different logic path altogether.

Posted by: Palindrome at November 18, 2003 12:38 AM

Looks probable to me. But, I do think two other
things came immediately into play as well:
the WMDs and democracy promotion.

9/11 forced the Bush administration into the
thought that Al'Qaeda and its allies are at
war with us. That makes the worries about the
Islamic Bomb rather real, especially when a state
that was very close to the Nuke Club also acts
exactly as if it's at war with you. This case
has been out there to make since '98; I was
disappointed in Clinton for not taking more
decisive action than he did. I think Tony Blair
was, too; I think he monged war bigtime back then,
but in private.

Democracy promotion converted it from revenge and
keeping bad things from happening to also moving
the American ball forward AND giving some hope to Iraq
the region.

Note that Bush couldn't say too much about
democracy promotion BEFORE the war, or we'd have
lost even the limited in-region supportr we had.
In particular, Saudi Arabia was on our side and
helped out a bit; that sure wouldn't've
happened if Bush had given this month's speech
back then....

Posted by: Jon Kay at November 19, 2003 02:18 AM

As the Bush team started talking about Iraq almost as soon as the last bombs fell in Afganistan, the decision had to have been made within a short time frame of 9/11.

This was/is a war of choice and one I support while recognizing it as very risky and one which may not succeed.

BTW, you can dispense with calling Andrew Sullivan a zealot, merely pro-war will do. If you read him consistently, you will note that he is often critical of Bush on a wide range of issues, including aspects of the war.

I have read enough of your opinions to ask myself, between what two points on the political spectrum do you consider yourself to be centrist?

I would consider you to be left of center-left.

Posted by: tallan at November 22, 2003 10:08 PM
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